Keeping Your Spiritual Tank Full

[00:00:02] Speaker A: Talk about taking the scenic route. I think God takes the scenic route an awful lot. And we can forget sometimes that we're playing checkers and he's playing 3D chess or whatever it is. There's so many things that I wish God would have just answered it right away the way I wanted it. But he takes forever to answer it. But in that time, it wasn't fruitless. He gave me 12 blessings for the one that I was asking for. It was well worth it in the end, and I sure am glad he didn't just answer it the first time I asked like I wanted it to. [00:00:28] Speaker B: But if you look, Jesus says, keep asking and keep seeking, keep knocking. No, I think it's something that builds up our faith. And oftentimes, remember, prayer is not so much about us changing God, it's about God changing us. [00:00:47] Speaker A: Christian asked me yesterday when I picked him up. He said, who owns the church? And I said, they don't have owner. I said, ben's kind of the boss of the church. Because it's like, which direction are you trying to go with this? Like, who's in charge? Or who. [00:01:01] Speaker B: Who owns the. [00:01:02] Speaker A: He's like. I was like, ben's kind of the boss. He said, he doesn't own it. Okay. [00:01:06] Speaker B: I mean, according to the bylaws, constitution, I'm kind of one of the officers. [00:01:11] Speaker C: I didn't know you were the boss man. [00:01:13] Speaker B: I don't know that I'm the boss. I'm an under shepherd. Yeah. [00:01:17] Speaker A: Do we have a board of directors or technically? [00:01:20] Speaker B: Nah, the way we're drawn up is we have officers, and senior pastor's an officer, church treasurer is an officer, and the secretary is an officer. That's the way we're drawn up. [00:01:33] Speaker C: That's on paper. But in the end, what don't get done, he does. That's really usually what happens. [00:01:41] Speaker B: But then we also have the elders that kind of. But they're not necessarily the board per se. It used to be most churches would set it up where the deacons were, the board. And that can lead to. [00:01:52] Speaker C: Well, there's just too many people. Yeah, at least 24 people. We might as well just have a congress or something. We'll never get anything done all the time but do nothing. [00:02:02] Speaker A: Well, I ended up telling Christian, I said, well, technically. I said, I guess the members own it. And he said, I don't know if he asked if I was a member or. So I said, yeah, I'm a member and Gabe's a member. He said, am I a member? I said, well, no. You're not a member, but you know, you will be one day. And. But I was like, you know, I said, but that's. There's like 300 members. So, I mean, you know, it's not. [00:02:23] Speaker B: Like we're homes and so. But if something were to happen. And again, it'd be very rare. But if we had to sell the building, I mean, golly, I don't know. [00:02:34] Speaker A: Nobody's getting the money for that. It's a non. I'm saying it's a non profit organization. [00:02:37] Speaker B: So it's not gonna get it. But I don't know what. [00:02:41] Speaker C: I've never been involved in a church sale, so I don't know what happened. [00:02:43] Speaker B: I mean, it would have to be. I can't even think of. Well, I mean, there's some that they close down. [00:02:49] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:02:49] Speaker B: And then they're selling the building. [00:02:50] Speaker A: Some of the building. Yeah. [00:02:51] Speaker B: And. And sometimes it's the, you know, some of the smaller churches, if it ain't a Baptist or if it's a non denominational, it might be the pastor or whoever put forward the money. [00:03:02] Speaker A: I see that now. [00:03:03] Speaker C: I have seen that. [00:03:04] Speaker B: Where the pastor cut all the money. Now, Methodist churches, the Methodist association owns the buildings and that's what creates a big mess. Did you get a haircut, Kenny? [00:03:17] Speaker A: He did. [00:03:18] Speaker B: Yeah, I did. Looks nice. I like it. I like the way that you've kind of got it going like down this way. It kind of looks. It looks young and. And carefree. [00:03:27] Speaker A: Yeah. It cost me a little close on the side, too. It's like a little fade. [00:03:30] Speaker C: It cost me an arm and a leg. [00:03:31] Speaker A: You did tell them a story about that. [00:03:33] Speaker B: Yeah, I heard about the. You're a generous tipper. [00:03:35] Speaker C: Yeah, Yeah, I would. The 25 is what I wanted to give total, not the tip. But. [00:03:41] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, I've done that. Yeah. Cost my. I've always said if you lower your cost, you get a bigger tip. Because I'm doing 25. [00:03:48] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:03:48] Speaker C: Yeah. I ain't even get the senior discount on that. That's. [00:03:52] Speaker A: Surely they knew you were senior. [00:03:53] Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, I'm really not. Not for them. [00:03:57] Speaker B: Well, how's their definition? [00:03:58] Speaker C: Yeah, it depends. It can be 55. [00:04:01] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:04:01] Speaker C: But you're getting close to that. [00:04:03] Speaker B: Getting close. [00:04:05] Speaker C: Are you 50? [00:04:05] Speaker B: All I know is golf is 55 and I'm moving on up. [00:04:09] Speaker A: Well, and in. In PGA Champions, it's 50. [00:04:12] Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, I should already be there. [00:04:14] Speaker A: Yeah, you're already there. [00:04:15] Speaker B: I played it white this year. [00:04:18] Speaker C: Or 56. [00:04:19] Speaker B: 55. [00:04:20] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. Yeah. [00:04:23] Speaker B: I was told Bojangles is 55. [00:04:25] Speaker C: Is it okay? [00:04:26] Speaker B: That's what I was told. [00:04:27] Speaker A: When is your birthday? [00:04:27] Speaker B: You got one August 20th. [00:04:29] Speaker C: 20Th is the 20th, man. I already got it. [00:04:32] Speaker B: More. [00:04:33] Speaker A: It was easy to remember last year. [00:04:34] Speaker C: Because we call on a Tuesday meeting, I have all. I know, everybody's birthday this month, then next, I'll forget about it. Then I'll know everybody's birthday next month because I have to do cards and all that. [00:04:44] Speaker A: Yep, gotcha. [00:04:45] Speaker B: Yeah. You don't sit down on the first and do them all. [00:04:48] Speaker C: No, because I like to do it. Spend a lot. I know you have to. [00:04:53] Speaker B: Yeah, well, I'll do it on the first. I just have to do three every day is what I have to do. [00:04:58] Speaker C: I like to spend time and think about what I'm saying because I don't have as many. [00:05:03] Speaker A: You do, too, though. [00:05:05] Speaker C: I know he does, but I didn't. [00:05:06] Speaker B: Mean to say, man, what are you saying? [00:05:08] Speaker C: But I like to bring mine. I don't like to write it on the 1st. And somebody's birthday's on the 29th. [00:05:13] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Well, see, I'm famous for. You got a birthday coming up, It'll be three weeks away. Oh, yeah. But it's three weeks away because you blocked the list. That's right. I've already made your card. [00:05:23] Speaker A: I don't know who it is in the church that gets this confused, but for whatever reason, there's somebody that always gets confused with me in, like, March. So I'm getting birthday texts and cards in March sometimes. [00:05:32] Speaker C: Maybe it's your birthday that's wrong. [00:05:35] Speaker A: No, my birthday is the same. It's always been. [00:05:38] Speaker C: No, I'm saying maybe it's keyed in wrong. [00:05:42] Speaker A: I don't think so. I get one in November, too. [00:05:45] Speaker B: You get one from me, right? [00:05:47] Speaker A: I do. There's like, two years in a row I get a card from you in November. But then I got a text from you two years ago, like, right before Easter, saying, happy Birthday. [00:05:57] Speaker B: Hold on. [00:05:57] Speaker A: Because I was confused by that. And then somebody else in the church texted me this year. No, somebody else in the church texted me this year and said, happy Birthday. And I was like, thanks, but it ain't my birthday. [00:06:06] Speaker C: So I think the problem is. What's your birthday? [00:06:10] Speaker A: November 6th. [00:06:12] Speaker B: Yeah. When I bet it is. [00:06:16] Speaker A: I think I still get the card at the right time, though. I know I do. Because last year you had. You told me. [00:06:22] Speaker B: Did you get two last year? [00:06:24] Speaker A: Oh, I don't get a card. [00:06:25] Speaker B: I was gonna say if I sent you one in March. [00:06:26] Speaker A: No. [00:06:27] Speaker B: Then in November, it's Cause we fixed it after March. [00:06:29] Speaker A: No, you sent it in November last year. Because I didn't look at it and see. [00:06:33] Speaker C: You said it just happened this year. [00:06:36] Speaker A: Well, no, it wasn't from being this year. I got a text from somebody else. [00:06:38] Speaker C: I mean, it's happened in March, but. [00:06:40] Speaker B: Now there is another Garrett that I don't think y'. [00:06:42] Speaker A: All. [00:06:42] Speaker B: I mean, it shouldn't be any close. [00:06:44] Speaker A: Yeah, I don't know. I mean, the name so far, you wouldn't think. I don't know. Some reason or another, though, it's. But now I get it in November. [00:06:52] Speaker B: I don't know how you do that. [00:06:53] Speaker A: So I just get two of you. [00:06:54] Speaker B: Look at it on the computer because that's what. Hey, man, if it weren't for that computer, I don't know how I'd keep going. Everybody's birthday. [00:06:59] Speaker C: It might not be the computer, but it might be. Yeah, maybe they have. Maybe they're working on a list. Yeah, I. I will check and make sure the computer's right. [00:07:08] Speaker A: Okay, we can do that. Okay. Oh, man. Well, welcome back, guys. [00:07:12] Speaker B: Good to. Hello. [00:07:13] Speaker A: Good to see you. I miss Brandon this week. [00:07:14] Speaker C: It was fun having him last night. [00:07:15] Speaker B: I tell you what, it was. I. I enjoyed that. [00:07:18] Speaker C: You'll be playing baseball tonight if you want to go to the game. [00:07:22] Speaker A: Where's where they play at? [00:07:23] Speaker B: Right across, right behind Harnet. Cat. Harnett Central. [00:07:27] Speaker A: What time they play? [00:07:29] Speaker B: I've got to go 8:45. [00:07:32] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:07:33] Speaker B: Or is it 6? 45? It's like 8. [00:07:35] Speaker A: 45. I can't do that. [00:07:36] Speaker B: Yeah, I was gonna say I love you. [00:07:39] Speaker A: I gotta adjust. The kids go back to school next week, so I gotta start getting them in bed a little earlier and getting them up a little earlier. Get them back in the swing so. [00:07:47] Speaker C: That Don Gray's a good baseball softball player. From what I heard. Hit three hangar ends last time. [00:07:52] Speaker A: Oh, nice. Is this a champion? [00:07:53] Speaker C: Every time you bat, you're batting. Do what? [00:07:57] Speaker A: It's not the championship. [00:07:58] Speaker C: I don't know. This is my first. My first trip. Renee's been going this summer. [00:08:02] Speaker A: Gotcha. So my apologies, officially to Renee. She got on me Sunday at church because last week I referred to Brandon as our only listener, and she said that offended her. And that is very fair because she does comment as regularly and routine as every single time we put one out. She's got a comment and she likes it and she watches it. So I was very wrong for saying that. Renee, I apologize. We do have two listeners, and I completely forgot our executive producer, but. And she's also our shirt supplier. So sorry, Renee forgot you. Here's my penance for that. I missed that one. [00:08:37] Speaker B: So we do have two listeners. No, I believe there's more than that. [00:08:41] Speaker C: Absolutely. [00:08:41] Speaker A: Yeah, we've got more analytics that we have more. [00:08:44] Speaker B: And jammin jelly season's coming up. That's when it is. [00:08:47] Speaker A: That's when it picks up. [00:08:48] Speaker C: It's done. [00:08:50] Speaker B: Do you know I got a grape off the vine the other day. I've got grapes fixing to come in. [00:08:55] Speaker A: When are they supposed to come in? What's the season? [00:08:57] Speaker B: Usually it's August. September. September. October is usually when you have it. [00:09:00] Speaker C: Yeah, it's early. [00:09:00] Speaker B: In fact, I've got figs on my tree right now. I gotta call certain somebody who makes fig preserves. [00:09:06] Speaker C: Oh, my mother used to make that. I used to like them. We had some fig trees too. [00:09:11] Speaker B: I gotta call her. I gotta make sure she gets her figs. She said, I'll make you some preserves. Fig preserves or. She didn't call it a fig jam or jelly. [00:09:22] Speaker C: I don't think. I've never heard of that. [00:09:24] Speaker B: I think that'd be nasty if it was. [00:09:25] Speaker A: Right. [00:09:26] Speaker C: Yeah, my mother used to make fig preserves. [00:09:28] Speaker B: Is that what's in that Fig Newton? [00:09:30] Speaker C: Yeah, fig. [00:09:32] Speaker B: But I mean that jelly stuff that's in it. [00:09:35] Speaker C: Well, I don't know. [00:09:36] Speaker B: I don't make them. [00:09:37] Speaker C: You like them fig? [00:09:39] Speaker B: They are, man, they're nasty. [00:09:40] Speaker C: The strawberries ones are good. Is that a strawberry almond in it. [00:09:45] Speaker B: Or is it strawberry flavored figs? Yeah, you have to grow them near a strawberry fig. Cross pollinate. Yeah. [00:09:53] Speaker C: They are red. [00:09:54] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:09:55] Speaker C: Renee likes them, but I. I just. [00:09:59] Speaker B: Not really. [00:09:59] Speaker A: They're okay. I mean, I don't mind them, but I don't ever have. [00:10:03] Speaker B: Ain't going out of my way to eat. But I got a fig tree. Yeah. Right there beside my graveyard. [00:10:08] Speaker A: I don't even know what a fig is exactly. Is it a fruit of some sort? [00:10:12] Speaker B: It comes off the tree. [00:10:13] Speaker A: Is it like a berry? [00:10:15] Speaker B: No, it grows like a. [00:10:17] Speaker C: That's a big. [00:10:17] Speaker B: Today it looks like a big bloom almost. And they turn brown. They get brown, right? This time of year. They're right. [00:10:24] Speaker C: They're purple. [00:10:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:25] Speaker C: Browns is. They've been on there too long. [00:10:28] Speaker B: Right. So mine are green right now with one that's purple. [00:10:32] Speaker C: Okay. Are they the big ones or the small ones? [00:10:36] Speaker B: I think they're probably average, medium. [00:10:40] Speaker A: He don't know. [00:10:40] Speaker B: I don't, man. I got a tree. I just take care of it. I don't know how to grow them. I Don't know how to do anything with them. Give me grapes. I can make you some grape vines or grape. Give me some grapevine. I'll make you some grapes. I love those. [00:10:52] Speaker C: Yeah. When do you prune your grapevine? [00:10:57] Speaker B: Valentine's Day, man. It's gotta be done by Valentine's Day now. I did it this year. [00:11:01] Speaker C: What do you do with the vine? What do you do with the vine? [00:11:03] Speaker B: I make wreaths. And so Ben's Reefs. [00:11:08] Speaker C: My mother used to do that, and I used to have to do them for her. [00:11:11] Speaker B: You know what I do? I drag them off into the woods and throw them down there, hoping that some wild ones will sprout, because sometimes they will. [00:11:19] Speaker C: I've got one growing around my house. [00:11:20] Speaker B: I'd love to have some wild ones down the tree. And you don't prune them. [00:11:24] Speaker C: You just grow up in the trees and everything. [00:11:27] Speaker B: And they'll run the. [00:11:28] Speaker A: Run that great vines. [00:11:30] Speaker C: They can get real big. I mean, I've seen. Well, when I say big, I've seen the vines about that thick. [00:11:35] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:11:35] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:11:36] Speaker C: They grow wild. I know they grow wild along the coast. [00:11:39] Speaker B: Well, they had to. They had to come somewhere. [00:11:41] Speaker C: One of them traveled all the way. [00:11:45] Speaker B: They traveled west. [00:11:48] Speaker A: I have a very random starter question, though. I had this a couple weeks ago. I don't know if there's anything to this or not, but I was reading in the inter Testamentary period, there's commentary on that. And I never really connected this or not. And maybe there's not a connection, but I'm just curious. So the Jews in the Old Testament were constantly rebelling against God, getting in trouble, going into exile, going into slavery, coming back, repenting, coming back, repeat the cycle two or three times. And so you've got. That's like one side of the coin here. And then at the same time, I know that in recent history that the Jews have faced oppression and a lot of. I mean, the Holocaust is the most famous example. But you always hear the plot of the Jewish people, all these types of things, and circling back at it, I thought, well, you know, that it seems like basically since the crucifixion of Christ, that was kind of the end of their last. They've not done very well since that time period. It doesn't seem like. It seems like it's been an uphill battle for them ever since. And I just sort of think about that. I never connected these two. And like I said, there may not be a connection, but is there anything is that. I don't even want to say A judgment from God. But is it some form of other supporting evidence that Jesus was the Christ? That since they killed the son of God, things haven't really gone their way since that time? I mean, maybe I'm reading way too much into something that's not there. Or maybe there is, I don't know. [00:13:25] Speaker C: But are you asking, is it because they crucify Christ that they are scattered? [00:13:32] Speaker A: So you've got the. They were already under Roman control, right? I mean, that was already. So they already weren't a nation, you know, at that point. But then it was, you know, 40 years later that the temple was destroyed. 70 A.D. yeah. So then after 70 A.D. they were scattered and they didn't come back together to what, 1948. Right. So, you know, you had a 1900 year almost. If you look at the Old Testament where they were, it was back and forth, back and forth. You know, they were in Egypt, they get out, they're in Israel, they go into the promised land and then they mess things up and they go back into slavery. And then they come back and they go back to slavery. [00:14:14] Speaker B: Come back. [00:14:15] Speaker A: But this was all like 3, 400 year cycles, right? Then after Jesus, they're scattered for almost 2,000 years before they're finally pulled back together in 1948 or whatever that was. So is that just a total coincidence or is there anything, is there anything else in there that I'm missing? It almost seems like two distinct periods in Jewish history, right? Pre Christ and then after Christ. It's been a totally different. [00:14:40] Speaker B: Right. I don't know that you can. I don't know there's anything in the scriptures that's going to say that's because of that. I do know that one of the prophecies that was fulfilled in 1948 and many people felt, okay, Christ is coming back soon because Israel would become a nation again and he would bring it back. So they've been established as a nation. That's good. Which means, all right, that's one more prophecy that's in place, which there's several still to go. But man, they're getting ticked off left and right that we believe Christ is coming back soon. When? I don't know, but soon. Closer to today than we were yesterday. Right. But at the same time, was that because they rejected the Messiah? I don't know that I can take you to a scripture that says that. I could foresee that probably would not bode well for anybody. [00:15:31] Speaker A: Right. [00:15:31] Speaker B: At the same time, they're still God's chosen people, or part of God's. Chosen people, so he loves them and cares for the nation of Israel. I still believe the promises that are made in Genesis 12 hold to today. And that's what, six, seven, eight, 10,000 years or 8,000 years later? He promises Abraham and those who bless you, I will bless. And those who curse you, I will curse. I believe those blessings are still there. I believe Israel was always supposed to be a light unto the nations because that's one of the reasons that we saw this past week, God, if you destroy these people, your people, then how are they going to be alight? Yeah, we're not shining very bright, but how are we going to be alight? And so they were chosen as that. And when they rejected Christ, was that a piece of it? Yeah, I could see that very easily. Well, you said I have biblical evidence to back that up. [00:16:29] Speaker C: I think what you're saying is great. I mean, they went into captivity first because of the rejection of God because of idol worship. And I don't, I guess the light was taken from them as far as spreading the gospel because, and given to the Gentiles. But whether they lost God's blessing or why they were scattered, I, I'm not sure. I, I, well, it's not the, that I know about. I mean because everybody crucified Christ. It wasn't just the Jews, but. [00:17:05] Speaker A: Right. [00:17:06] Speaker C: Initiated it definitely. But I think they did lose the, the ministry, if you can call it ministry of presenting the gospel to the world. And it went through the Christian. [00:17:23] Speaker B: I was going to church. [00:17:24] Speaker C: Yeah. That's the only thing that I, I don't think they were. Became scattered. They became scattered because they weren't obeying God's law. But I don't know that they became scattered because they crucified Christ. I don't. That's it. [00:17:38] Speaker B: Or even just rejected Christ. [00:17:40] Speaker A: Well, let's look at this. Let me spin this for a second. I didn't intend this, but I kind of like the way it's going here. Let's think cause and effect for a second here. Maybe I was suggesting, and maybe that is how I meant it, that it was a punishment almost from God. But there's a flip side of that also that, okay, they were, I mean for the entire Old Testament they were in fellowship with God on and off to a great extent. But since, I mean they've been, I hate to use it this way, but it sounds very judgmental. But living in sin. But they've rejected the Messiah. So they're not walking with the Lord. [00:18:20] Speaker B: For the last Christian nature by means. [00:18:23] Speaker A: So cause and effect of that is from the effect of rejecting the Messiah. They haven't been walking in that same fellowship. Well, not walking in the fellowship with the Lord is going to rob you of some benefits that you had when you were walking with Him. And it's going to be a hindrance too. So it's not necessarily your place. I just, I know my life is a lot better when I'm walking with him than when I'm not. [00:18:46] Speaker B: But I think also, I mean, that's. There's also this. The individual versus the nation. Right. [00:18:52] Speaker A: And that's what I'm. [00:18:53] Speaker B: And sometimes that, you know, and that's. Where does God still deal with Israel like he did in the Old Testament of okay, I need obedience from you. Seek after me and you'll be blessed. Go after other gods, you're going to be cursed. I mean, that's Deuteronomy 26 and 28 altogether. And we'll talk about that some coming up this Sunday. And that's the way he dealt with Israel in the past. Is that the same Israel he's dealing with now? And does he still relate? I believe he still relates to them. He still loves them. If you read Revelation, I believe there's going to be a great outpouring of the Spirit upon Israel, that many Jews are going to get saved towards the end. And I'm excited for that. [00:19:38] Speaker A: And is it fair to say to some extent that we're Messianic Jews? Was that even a thing 200 years ago? Has that always been. Have there always been some Jews that were actually Jews? [00:19:51] Speaker B: Oh, I'm sure. [00:19:52] Speaker A: Except Christ. [00:19:53] Speaker C: Well, that's how the gospel. [00:19:54] Speaker B: I was going to say the church was Messianic Jews to start with. [00:19:58] Speaker A: So Jew and Christian is not necessarily mutually exclusive. [00:20:03] Speaker B: Oh, let me think about that now. No, no, you can be. [00:20:05] Speaker A: You can be both. [00:20:06] Speaker B: I mean, that's what Paul, Peter, all them were. [00:20:09] Speaker A: I mean, they weren't Jews who became Christians. They were Jews who. But they didn't stop being Jews once they became Christians. [00:20:17] Speaker B: I mean, Jew is. Yeah. And that's where, you know, I'm an American before I was a Christian. [00:20:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:24] Speaker B: I'm still an American Christian. [00:20:26] Speaker A: Okay. It's not like Islam. You can't be Islam and Christian. [00:20:29] Speaker B: Yeah, that's it. You can be Jew and Christian, but Jew. But that's the thing is there's a practicing Jew. And that's where like right now, today, a lot of people are Jewish. They don't practice Judaism. That's in name. I was born to My parents were Jewish. Jewish has become of the nation of Israel. At the same time, practicing Judaism is totally different. And so, yeah, and Peter, or let's just say Paul, Paul was practicing Judaism and was a Jewish. In fact, he says, I was a Jew of the Jews, I was a Hebrew of the Hebrews, but now I'm following Christ, but he's still Jewish in the fact he's born a Jew. [00:21:10] Speaker A: So Judaism is not accepting Christ. Doesn't go against Jewish doctrine, so to speak, necessarily where you're. [00:21:24] Speaker C: I mean, that's part of the scriptures that they read that the Messiah is coming. They don't believe the Messiah has come yet. They don't think the Messiah was coming. [00:21:35] Speaker A: And changing your mind and thinking and accepting Christ doesn't exclude you now from being a Jew because now you accept Christ. [00:21:43] Speaker B: Jew by birth, but Jew by practice and religion. Usually that's what the whole book of Galatians is about, is there were some in the church that were teaching. You still got to be doing these Jewish things. I mean, Paul writes extensively. Think about Titus. Titus, they said he needs to be circumcised. He was born a Gentile. [00:22:04] Speaker A: So if you're practicing, if you're still. [00:22:08] Speaker B: Practicing all the laws, okay, there's a difference. But I can be born a Jew, but I don't have to practice Judaism. [00:22:15] Speaker A: Still a Jew. [00:22:17] Speaker B: Right? Makes sense. [00:22:18] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:22:18] Speaker B: But now I could be a Orthodox Jew or, you know, there's so many different things. Orthodox says I'm practicing just like the Old Testament. [00:22:26] Speaker A: But I think what I'm trying to ask is there's the practicing of all of the cultures and the festivals and all that kind of stuff, which they. [00:22:35] Speaker B: Don'T do much of now. [00:22:37] Speaker A: Right. But if someone's a Jew and they now say, I believe Jesus was the Messiah, believing Jesus was the Messiah doesn't mean that you are against. If you're a Christian, then you are proclaiming Christ as the Savior, as the Messiah, but claiming that he's the Messiah doesn't go against Jewish. They're not kicking you out of. They're not saying that you're in sin because you accept Christ. Or are they. [00:23:07] Speaker C: Is it going against. [00:23:09] Speaker B: I would say many of them probably would. [00:23:11] Speaker A: Many would. So it is something. [00:23:12] Speaker B: You have to put it down. It all depends on what the family believes or where you are. If you are an Orthodox Jew, I mean, and you're practicing the old school Judaism again, they don't do the sacrifices and all that anymore. They still have some of the feasts. But if you're An Orthodox Jew. And let's say I'm a parent and I have some kids and all of a sudden they turn to Christ. That would be frowned upon. Tragic. [00:23:38] Speaker A: Okay, so that wouldn't. That's what they didn't. Yeah. [00:23:41] Speaker B: And it's kind of like almost like. I mean, it can be to some degree just like Islamic if I'm Islam, if we're practicing Islam and it's kind of like Muslim, Islam, Jew, Jewish. And if all of a sudden I'm a practicing Muslim and my son decides he's going to follow Christ, man, you talk about you're going right outside of it. [00:24:06] Speaker A: So it is a point of friction, so to speak. It's not optional. You can believe he is or you cannot if you are an Orthodox Jew and practicing Jew. And that's almost false. It is. In their eyes, worshiping a false God would be the way they would do it. [00:24:21] Speaker B: And think about how the early church was attacked and persecuted. It was the Jewish leaders that were doing that. Because of that, they're trying to prevent. Again, think about one of the reasons that Phariseeism was so prominent during Jesus time was, man, they saw it as their right and their duty, their call from God to keep the nation on the right track. And here's this upstart group called the Way, or Christians. They're taking people away. We got to stop this thing. [00:24:56] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. And I guess that was part of it is wondering did that after the Resurrection, after, you know, now 2,000 years later, is there still such a. I don't know if animosity is the right word between Jewish leadership. Jewish. [00:25:12] Speaker B: I think it depends on where. If you're an Orthodox. Orthodox. I don't know that the animosity is there as much as it is. They probably would frown down upon it and say. They would say we're not where I would say we came from them, they might agree with that. But we're not of the same ilk. [00:25:33] Speaker C: There is. And this is coming from Matt because talk to him about this. So I'm quoting him. Matt. [00:25:42] Speaker B: Matt Abrams. [00:25:43] Speaker C: Yeah, Abrams. [00:25:45] Speaker B: That's who I was going to say. He'd be a good one to bring up. [00:25:48] Speaker C: He was telling me, telling me that there is a Israelites, the Jews, they had a lot of animosity towards Christians and it has to do with how the church handled World War II and so. [00:26:09] Speaker B: Or even the Crusades. [00:26:12] Speaker C: Well, he was just saying about World War II and it could be. I know the Islam has a problem with that, but he was telling us because the Church, whatever church was in Germany, they supported the Nazis for a long time. And today they still have a lot of animosity against Christians because they're not. We think of. I think it was the Catholic Church. You know, there's a lot of branches, but if you're a Jew, you think all Christianity the same and it's not. So based on what they know about Christianity, they are biased towards all Christianity, all religions, because of the Catholic. [00:26:53] Speaker B: See, I would think that would be more towards the German Church because the German church was the one that basically turned an eye and let's say facts. I mean, to some degree, Hitler and the Nazis proclaimed to have some form of religion to them. [00:27:10] Speaker C: Well, he didn't specify Germany or not. He just said that. I mean, in general, I don't know if he was talking about. [00:27:16] Speaker B: I thought talk to him about that. That'd be a great conversation. [00:27:19] Speaker C: That's what he had told me that when he was doing his. Well, he had tell me. He told everybody he was doing his testimony that. And I don't know if Israel is against American Christians, but they are against Christianity. I should say that. [00:27:36] Speaker B: I'd be willing to bet right now they're not. [00:27:38] Speaker C: Well, they probably might be in their heart, but they're not going to say it. Yeah, because we're not supporting them. That's where Islam is against Christianity. A lot of it has to do with the Crusades and the Jews are against Christianity because of World War II and it might be the Crusades too. [00:27:59] Speaker B: There was some ill things that took place there too. [00:28:03] Speaker C: But the Jews are just like Americans. They're all over the board. [00:28:08] Speaker B: And in reality Jewish now and again, not all of them, but in reality Jewish is. I'm born to a family that's Jewish. It's almost like being Italian or being German or being American. [00:28:21] Speaker C: They're just as secular and they may. [00:28:23] Speaker B: Not even practice anything. Yeah, but they may. They may know of the history. And Passover is when we celebrate when we got out of freedom from Egypt and we'll go for a Passover meal or have the Seder meal together. [00:28:37] Speaker A: It's just a festival, but it's like the fall fair around here. [00:28:43] Speaker C: It's made up stories. Yeah, I don't think it's made up stories. [00:28:47] Speaker A: Well, it's interesting to me when I'm reading the Bible, especially the Old Testament, I guess, but really the entire Bible, to think about the parallels between what was going on then and what's going on now, because it's really easy to get to kind of Be put to sleep a little bit by thinking that all this is ancient history and this stuff doesn't happen anymore. But most of the things that you read about in the Bible happen in some way, shape or form today also. And I almost find myself, I don't know how to say this, but almost dreaming up or trying to imagine. Oh, yeah, I could see if a scene from today's. If we were still adding to the Bible 2,000 years ago, what would the scene, or 2,000 years from now, what would the scenes of today look like in the Bible? You know what I mean? Almost viewing today's world as a biblical lens or whatever. And it's. I don't know, it's just interesting to think of how many of the same things that were going on then are still going on now and are still, you know, it's. [00:29:44] Speaker B: No, I've always. I've always bought into the fact of. I don't. The more things change, the more they stay the same. [00:29:49] Speaker A: That's right. [00:29:50] Speaker B: Yeah. And you know, you can go Genesis chapter three, but go right after that, Genesis chapter four. Listen, there's always been hate, there's always been jealousy, and there's always been murder. Since sin entered. We just come up with more creative ways to do it. [00:30:07] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:30:08] Speaker B: And there just is more of it because there's more people. But in reality, that same is there. So it's not that much difference. [00:30:15] Speaker C: It can be. I guess the sins today can be more enticing, but they're the same, you think? I don't know. [00:30:23] Speaker B: I wouldn't think I'd be willing to bet on that. Fruit was very, very enticing. Just to see anything else that. [00:30:30] Speaker C: Well, let me see. [00:30:31] Speaker B: I don't think it's changed. [00:30:32] Speaker C: It can be more. [00:30:35] Speaker B: I think we have more of it. We have more in the fruit, more. [00:30:39] Speaker A: Flavor, it's more prevalent. We have more fruit. [00:30:42] Speaker B: There's more to choose from. I mean, we really do. You got more to choose from, but it's still the same, the same characteristics. The lust of the eyes, lust of the flesh, and the pride of life is the three categories that all of them are going to fall in. [00:30:58] Speaker C: Nothing's been created. That's just how you present them. [00:31:02] Speaker B: That's it. [00:31:03] Speaker A: It's funny to me how. How much I see God. God proves himself over and over and over again throughout the Bible, throughout history, throughout our lives. He reveals himself to us in a way that we can. And it's almost mind bending to me sometimes to. I mean, you believe it's real, you know, it's real. And then he shows you that it's real. And it's still a little bit hard to wrap my head around sometimes that the almighty powerful of everything in the entire universe gives a crap about me in any way, shape or form. But I know he does. I feel that he does. I see that he does. It's just amazing to wrap your head around sometimes that, oh, it is all true. Every bit of it is true. And a lot of people read the Bible and think it's fantasy, think this could never happen, this could never happen. But the more you get to know the Word, the more it shows itself to be the truth. And then it gets to a point where it's, like, unbelievable. Not in a I don't believe it, but like when you see Michael Jordan dunk it off the. You know, take a quarter off the top of the backboard, you know it's real. You just can't believe it. You know what I mean? I think I've experienced that a little bit. And sometimes it's just seeing the fruits in others, you see the. I was thinking of a story the. The other day when I was about 11 years old, I was playing golf one day, and this guy I'd never met catches up with me, or I was trying to play through him or something, and he looked at me, he said, you must be Dan. How are you related to Danny Leal? I said, I'm his son. And he said, I knew you had to be related to him because you look just like him. [00:32:33] Speaker B: Golly. Yeah. [00:32:33] Speaker A: And I was thinking about it. When you spend time with other Christians or other people who have gone through an experience, or maybe you knew him before and now you know him later, and you see the change in them. And every child of God represents the same fruits in some way or another. I mean, they're all gonna take on different characteristics. But you can see that fruit in others and you recognize. It's like the saying, game recognizes game. Right? You recognize it in other people. [00:32:57] Speaker B: And I like to call that just like when someone knew you were Danny Lail's son. That's a family resemblance. We're a family, and we all should resemble something. And that something is Christ. And so there should be a family resemblance of. Even when you go across nations, even when you go on the other side of the world, there should be someone that. If you're walking with the Lord and they're walking with the Lord, that man. There's going to be some resemblances. It might not be skin tone, it might not Be, build. No, it's how we act, how we love, how we care. And that's kind of interesting. You stop and think about it, that it should be sort of uniform, if you really get down to it. Because love, that's the first thing. Here's one command I give you that you love one another. Yeah, you can obey my commands. I mean, there's several ways to. [00:33:50] Speaker A: You can take two people or 10 people or ever how many people you want to take, and they can share the specifics of their testimony. And each testimony is going to be a little bit different. That's all pretty stored in a story. [00:34:01] Speaker B: And how they got there or what they faced, the struggles they faced, they're going to be different and who they. [00:34:07] Speaker A: Were before are going to be very different. They're going to come from different walls. [00:34:10] Speaker B: But you different places. [00:34:12] Speaker A: But when you lay these people side by side after Christ and you find a whole lot more similarities. And it's just, it's fascinating to me, I guess, because it is its own. When you hear people say prove, how do you prove God? I hate it when atheists say, you can't prove it, you can't prove it. Well, proof is not the point at all, but there is a ridiculous amount of evidence to support it that once you are on that other side of it, you see that evidence all the time and other people and you look around and say, yeah, this is 100%. Because I can't explain how this person and that person, as opposite as they could have possibly been, both end up having these exact same traits. And I'll be darn if they aren't the exact same same traits that the Bible said they would have after they came to Christ. That is the proof or the evidence or the whatever. And it's. I don't know, I'm just asking it. [00:35:04] Speaker B: No, and I think going back too, I think the thing to remember is on all these stories, all these testimonies, yeah, they might start out different. They might, you know, some might have been born in this country. Some might have been born in a different country. Some might have been born upper, you know, class. Some might have been born, you know, in the, in the poorest of poorest. But. But it was the same grace that saved every one of them, regardless of race, regardless of socioeconomic background. It's grace. And then that grace is what enables us to live each day. That grace is what enables us to grow. That grace is what gets us through the tough times. And so that's where I'm sitting there saying, that's what's so amazing to me is God's grace that man can save a wretch like me. God's grace that can get me through the hardest, the most difficult times. God's grace that can help me to face cancer, death, death in a family, loss, whatever, you name it, we're going to face it. It's coming. It's not if it's when we're going to face it, but it's his grace that's going to get us through. That's what Paul says when. When he says, you know, three times I asked for this thorn in the flesh to be removed. I mean, all kinds of struggles he was having physically. Could that have been his eyes? Could that have been the beatings he took? I mean, I suppose it was a bunch of things, but he struggled. And God said, no, I'm not going to take it away from you. My grace is sufficient. It'll get you through. And so that's where leaning on that grace, knowing the promises of. Of God and holding on to those promises, that's what gets us through. And that's the testimony is man. He is good. [00:36:50] Speaker A: One of the things you said in the sermon last week was that doubt is just as serious as idolatry. And it's funny, because they both are the same thing. It's just. Idolatry is putting something above God, and doubt is thinking that something is over, is more powerful than God or that. [00:37:09] Speaker B: You don't believe it or you don't believe it. [00:37:11] Speaker A: Right. And that. That's not. When you say just as serious as idolatry. That's a bold statement, really, because idolatry, we know, is really bad. But, Boyd, we don't put doubt on that same level. We just think that's a justifiable human emotion or whatever. But. But no, it's. It makes. I give. I agree with you, and I believe it, but it's. We don't. [00:37:31] Speaker B: I don't like it. It was bold. Yeah, I don't like it. Yeah, there you go. I think, because, hey, I have a lot more doubt than I do idolatry. But we all have idols of the heart. Ezekiel 14. But at the same time, doubt and unbelief we wrestle with every day. And if you look, God is the same way when they worship the golden calf, Moses. I've had enough of these people. I'm starting a nation. It's just going to be me and you, Bo, and we're going to start it out. It's going to be better than anything Else they have doubt and unbelief. They're ready to go back to Egypt because the people are big. God says, moses, these people, it's time. Get rid of them. It's going to be me and you, Bo. Going to be a better nation. So I think it's one of. That's why I said, please understand doubt and unbelief to me if I was God 1. He's a jealous God is what scripture says. Yeah, I'd be jealous that you're chasing after other gods. That's silly. Why are you chasing after something that somebody carved out of a tree? But to have doubt and unbelief. That's. I mean, I don't know. I'd almost rather you go and worship something else than. You don't believe me or that. I've promised you and I've shown you for two years. I delivered you out of the land of Egypt. Egypt. I have provided you manna each and every day. How in the world could you doubt that? And they did. And it can happen, believe me. We have the Holy Spirit and we still doubt and have unbelief. So, I mean, I don't want to fault or point my fingers too much at Israelites, but I did Sunday, because it's kind of like, no, y' all have acted. This is the dumbest thing I've seen. Dumb in the fact that you won't elect a leader. Leader and go back to Egypt. Dumb in the fact of you want to stone Moses and Aaron and Joshua and Caleb. Dumb in the fact of you had God's presence and you chose not to go get the land. God's told you I ain't going to be with you. And that's when you decide you're going to be, you know, Chuck Norris and try to take the land by himself and get routed. I mean, just silly. [00:39:43] Speaker C: But don't you think that. Then why do. I didn't realize that there are. Maybe it's all so many Christians doubt at times every day. I just didn't tell Sunday school Sunday that everybody has doubt. [00:40:06] Speaker B: Sure. [00:40:07] Speaker C: Is that a. Is that on us or is that the enemy making us have doubt? [00:40:14] Speaker B: I think the enemy can do that. Hopefully it's on us. [00:40:18] Speaker C: Yeah. Yes. [00:40:19] Speaker B: I mean, the enemy loves to deceive. He loves to call it discourage, and he loves to cause you to doubt. If he can get you to do those three. You're whooped. [00:40:30] Speaker C: Well, that's not. I understand that. Is it our fallen nature to doubt God? [00:40:36] Speaker B: That part of it, I think that's a big piece of it. [00:40:39] Speaker C: I just didn't realize how many people doubt their salvation. I mean I think every Christian has. [00:40:44] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:40:45] Speaker C: Many times. Not just once. Many times. [00:40:47] Speaker B: As I said Sunday, you know, for these Israelites they had to choose to believe by faith God's promises of salvation. He was going to deliver them into the promised land. That's the same thing for us. We have to by faith believe the promises of God that Christ paid it on. [00:41:08] Speaker C: Renee and I understand what you're saying, but they had a little more than we have. And I mean we know the story but we weren't there present. [00:41:17] Speaker B: Right. [00:41:17] Speaker C: I mean I've never seen the Red Sea wide open. I've heard about it but I have never experienced it. [00:41:24] Speaker B: No. [00:41:25] Speaker C: Yeah, the miracles in my life hasn't been like that glorious. And so you're thinking why are they doubting? Are they doubting because they get so bogged down in their personal day to day life? [00:41:41] Speaker B: I think, I think that can't be. [00:41:43] Speaker C: Out of their memory. It hadn't been that long. [00:41:45] Speaker B: Right. Well I mean he calls them that they have spurned him. He calls them in different places stiff necked. He calls them self centered. I think it's really. I think the reason they doubt honestly is just like anything else. What is that the root cause of unbelief? What is the root cause of lack of faith is we look at the situation and we forget what God promised. [00:42:12] Speaker C: And that's why do you think that's why Psalms God says always and well not always but a lot of times in the Psalms remember what he did. Remember. Yes, remember constantly in the Psalms. [00:42:25] Speaker B: It's not just the psalms. It's all throughout the Old Testament and I believe it's all throughout. What's the Lord's supper is remember. [00:42:32] Speaker C: I guess we're fickle. [00:42:33] Speaker B: Well, we're fickle and we tend to forget and you know, that was last week. [00:42:39] Speaker C: He can't help me here or hey. [00:42:41] Speaker B: Look, we're leaky too because we're to be filled with the spirit. But dad gum, we leak and I need to be refilled again. And so yeah, I hate to pass. [00:42:50] Speaker C: So much judgment on the Israelites because I'm doing the same thing my way. [00:42:54] Speaker B: Well, we do the same on the disciples. [00:42:56] Speaker A: Yeah, look at them. [00:42:57] Speaker B: Idiot. [00:42:57] Speaker C: Yeah, and Thomas, he gets a bad rap because they all didn't believe it at first. [00:43:03] Speaker B: Right. [00:43:03] Speaker C: They just wasn't there when they, you. [00:43:05] Speaker B: Know, and dropped the gospels. Yeah, Thomas is actually pretty one of the bold ones that was, you know. [00:43:13] Speaker C: But he got a bad name, doubting Thomas when they all doubted. He just. It took him a little. [00:43:18] Speaker B: He just wanted evidence and proof to touch it. [00:43:21] Speaker C: And he wasn't there when Jesus appeared to him. I think he was absent on that day, came in later. [00:43:28] Speaker A: So I've thought about. Have you preached on Peter's denial recently? I don't think you. [00:43:37] Speaker B: I'm trying to think if I'd done it at Easter, I might have mentioned it, maybe. [00:43:40] Speaker A: I'm not sure where I thought of it. [00:43:41] Speaker B: I know I referenced it with the youth not too long ago, but I don't think I've done it in church. [00:43:47] Speaker A: I'm not sure where this came to my mind, but I thought about it, you know, I don't know. Total coincidence or maybe there was some reason for it. But he denied Christ three times. But he also denied that he was going to deny him three times. Jesus told him three times, you're going to do this. And three times. Three times he said, no, I'm not. I started thinking about it one day and I thought, you know, in a way, I'm not sure. I mean, I think I know which one's worse, but I'm not positive I know which one's worse. Because denying Jesus was pretty bad. But calling Jesus a liar to his face three times in a row probably. [00:44:15] Speaker B: Wasn'T too hot either. I'm going to be there. And again, same thing. We can talk to Big Game. Whether we show up for the game. That's a whole nother issue. [00:44:27] Speaker C: Filling the Spirit when he said he would deny him, but then when he got to fear of his life, that changed the game. [00:44:34] Speaker A: Yeah, but you talked about God exalts His name and His Word above all else. And I thought about when you talked about Moses using. He wasn't necessarily praying Scripture, but he was reciting back to God. God's character, his nature, His Word. And you said, when you pray, he will listen to your prayers. When you're praying his words back to him, essentially, when you're praying His Word and how much that can help you align yourself to pray his will, Right? Not just pray, give me what I want, but pray the things that are honoring him. I just jotted down in my notes. It's kind of strangely similar to the way he uses my words against me sometimes. I'm constantly saying things on the street or something, and then a week later I see it. I guess technically we're kind of using God's words back to him. And of course he's going to be maybe a little Bit more likely to relent and give us our way when we're telling him what he's already said to us. But we don't do that a lot, though. We tend to pray for what we want, not for really for the way God tells us to pray. [00:45:42] Speaker B: And I think you're going to see that, to bring that home. I wanted to plant the seed last Sunday, and we're going to bring it home with what do I mean by his name, His Word. You're going to see it in more evidence, more fleshed out in a man Named Daniel. And Daniel, chapter nine. His prayer is so filled with references to Scripture. I mean, it starts out with, I was reading the Book of Jeremiah. I mean, he doesn't write this per se, but basically verse two of that chapter says, and in the book of Jeremiah, it says 70 years that we would be in exile. Daniel does the math and finds out we're about four years out, give or take a little bit. And he begins to pray and pray hard because. Wait a minute. And so, lord, you've promised 70 years, Lord, you've promised. And so, Lord, we're going to repent now. And then the rest of the prayer is repentance. But he, even in that prayer, prayer says, God, you're justified. You told us in Deuteronomy, again, he doesn't quote it. We know it because he says the law of Moses. But Deuteronomy 26 and 28, God told them, you're going to go into the land, you're going to act a fool, you're going to reject me, you're going to run after other gods. And when you do that, I'm going to send you into exile. And lo and behold, he does. And time after time, even that 70 years that Jeremiah testified about that it was God's plan, saying, because this didn't happen, you're going there. So you're going to see a man use God's word and basically say, this is. And you see a man who is saturated in Scripture. But then you're also going to see him, the names he calls God. As far as Adonai, the Master, the Creator, the Righteous one, you are the holy. I mean, it is just unreal. So you see someone. And if there's anybody. Ezekiel 14:14 says, Even if a nation sins, and there were three great men like Noah, Job and Daniel, Daniel gets put in the top three according to Ezekiel. If you think of anybody that can pray better than Daniel, he's up there again. I'll submit Moses, and I'll submit Jesus, okay, that's not the same. I submit Paul. But Daniel, man, you talk about somebody who was able to get, I mean, dead gum. It was outlawed. You're not even allowed to pray. And what does he do? I'm going to pray three times a day. I don't care if you throw me in the lion's den, because I'm going to spend time with my Lord. And you see somebody who knows the Lord and knows the Scriptures and he knows how to pray. And that's going to be the key for us. I mean, if you're really going to grow in your walk and grow in your prayer life, you got to know the promises of God. [00:48:27] Speaker A: Yeah, well, one that I've mentioned, I was trying to memorize, do a better job of memorizing certain passages. And Proverbs 3, 5, 6 has been the one that I've been working on. But I've gotten that to the point where I can recite in my sleep now. But even taking that prayer and just turning. Taking that passage and I can turn it into a prayer, please don't let me lean on my own understanding and say, lord, please help me to just acknowledge you in everything that I do, every single thing that I do. [00:48:57] Speaker B: And God, you're worthy of acknowledgment for everything I do because you're all wise and you get that from all the other scriptures. But there's so many things that go off of that that you can just begin to pray and know that, okay, if I'm praying in accordance to God's word, that's when you're going to see it happen. And I believe that's what he says when, when we say, in Jesus name, I don't think it just means. I think it means, yes, by Jesus, I'm allowed access into the throne, but I think it also means, hey, according to your word, according to your name. We're summing all this up because of what Jesus did. [00:49:32] Speaker A: One thing that you talked about Sunday, that I shouldn't have been. So how do I say this? This shouldn't have made a mark on me maybe as much as it did, I think is what I'm trying to say. But when you talked about the difference that we can make in our prayers and how important it is, and you talked about the particular part of numbers where he said, I have pardoned 1421. I pardoned them according to your word. So he wouldn't have if it weren't for the prayer of Moses. [00:50:06] Speaker B: That's one of those things. So Was God just Moses? And does that make Moses, and I hate to say it, I mean, these are some of the things I was studying and reading the past week was, does that make Moses over God? [00:50:19] Speaker A: Did he have the ability to change God's mind? Or did God know? [00:50:23] Speaker B: I don't know that I would say that. I don't think so. I just think it is God says, hey, I've listened to you, Moses. I think he was going to pardon him, but somebody's going to ask, right? And okay, Moses, you're the one that did. [00:50:39] Speaker C: It's like, here's what I kind of take on. That is, it's like Abraham sacrificing Isaac because God told him to. God knew what he was going to do already, but Abraham didn't know. Abraham didn't know how he was going to react. God knew what he was going to do when he told Moses he was going to destroy them. But Moses didn't know how he was going to act. [00:51:05] Speaker B: And so I think it was more beneficial. I hesitated almost to say, is this a test that God has given Moses? Moses, I'm going to start over with you. These people had enough of them. I'm going to wipe them off the face of the earth. You're my new man. You're my new Abraham. And it still counts because you're of the line of Abraham. So I'll still be faithful to my promise I made. [00:51:25] Speaker C: Well, I think that, too. And I think also that Moses didn't know what he was going to do. [00:51:30] Speaker A: No. [00:51:31] Speaker C: And God showed God knew what he was going to do, but Moses didn't know how he was going to react. And I still proved to Moses that, oh, yes, I am more faithful than what I thought. [00:51:45] Speaker B: And it also proved, I mean, like I said, Moses is calling back God. You told us, you revealed to us that you are compassionate. You. You are slow to anger, you are forgiving, you are compassionate to the sinner. All those things you promised, and you revealed yourself that way. So just do it. You are who you are. [00:52:05] Speaker A: Do what you do. [00:52:06] Speaker C: It proved to Moses that he was on the right track. I'm not as prideful as I was because he could have said, yeah, you can start with me. But it was Moses proved to himself, himself that he would. And this is. You know, this might not be true, but this is how I take it that Moses proved himself that he was. Maybe he doubted somewhere down the road or whatever that he was following God's will. Does that make sense? [00:52:38] Speaker B: Well, I think it did. It definitely would help Moses to grow in his faith. [00:52:42] Speaker C: Moses just didn't know what he was going to do. [00:52:45] Speaker B: And like I said, I mean, Moses had a relationship that most people don't, even with the Holy Spirit living inside of us. I mean, the scripture says he talked to God face to face, or like, face to face, not necessarily sitting across, but he did get to see the backside of God. And God spoke to him and said, all right, Moses, we need to go. This, this, this, this. So. So he had a relationship unlike any, I dare say, probably closer than just about anybody on the earth. [00:53:18] Speaker C: It's like Peter denying Christ. Peter, he thought he was going to. He was going to stand right up. And then Peter realized when he got there, hey, I'm not as holy as I should have been. And reverse that. Maybe Moses was, hey, I'm not as bad as I thought I was. [00:53:41] Speaker B: I mean, I think it was good for Moses. Yeah, it had to be. At the same time, gave him more confidence. But I think it's also. It just goes to show that, you know, our prayers matter. That was the whole point, is our prayers matter. And when we think about life and death, heaven and hell being in the balance, man, we better give ourselves some praying because there's people who depend on it. [00:54:06] Speaker C: Well, what about. And this is. I think I know why, but I want to know what you all think. If God is going to do what he's going to do, why do we need to pray about it? [00:54:23] Speaker B: It's a great question. You want to put something for it? [00:54:27] Speaker A: Well, yeah, actually, I was going to say this. So last night I saw something on Facebook that was really someone I knew from high school that had an emergency they were asking for prayers on. And, you know, I always remember the prayers of a righteous man availeth much. So when something is. When I really need something, I email it to the Thursday morning Bible study and ask them to start praying, because there's a whole lot more righteousness in that room than I can do on my own. So I was. It's funny, it never ended up. They never got the email because I sent the email. And then when I got home, I realized that the server was down or something and never went out. So 100 people I sent this email to, and not a single soul ever prayed for it because they never got the email. Right. Well, then a couple hours later, I looked and they had an update that, you know, their little girl was fine and she had been in surgery, and it was, you know, scary thing, so everything was fine. And I started thinking about that, you know, Maybe this isn't the perfect example because, because they didn't get the email. But obviously them not praying for the situation didn't cost anything. You know, would them have, would them praying, Would that have been the difference? And, well, since the 80 ladies from Thursday morning prayed then now he helps and otherwise he wouldn't have. I don't know. But the purpose of it is, had the email gone out, that's 80 extra people that are praying and, and having a conversation with God. I mean, they would have been anyway. But that's just. He wants us communicating with Him. The will of God is that we are all communicating with Him. Right. So how big of a difference do the prayers make? Well, they make a big difference in the one thing that's the most important to God and that's the fellowship with Him. He wants us to talk to him. He wants us communicating with Him. So the more we pray for things, the more we ask other people to pray for things. A thousand people praying for one thing versus two people, which matters more? I don't know which is going to make a bigger difference, but I know which one God likes more. He likes a thousand people praying to him or the more the merrier. [00:56:20] Speaker B: Right. [00:56:20] Speaker A: So it's sort of a strange non answer to say that, but you're accomplishing the will of God by praying for and asking others to pray for things in and of itself, whether he answers yes or no to the prayer or not. You're doing his wheel just in the request itself, right? [00:56:42] Speaker C: Well, I mean, you're, you're. I think you're on the right track. I just want Ben to take us down the scenic road on this one. [00:56:50] Speaker A: I thought mine was the scenic road. [00:56:54] Speaker B: Mine's usually the country road, man. Come on, man. [00:56:58] Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, you riding down a lot. It must be a no going through the country road. [00:57:02] Speaker B: There's a couple of things and I was going to touch on that Sunday, but I knew I didn't have the time. If we were going to really dive into, okay, how is he praying and how do we apply that? And I'm hoping that this would come up a little bit. I think a couple things. When God knows what he's going to do, why on earth do we need to pray? In fact, that seems like an effort of futility for us. I think number one is what is prayer at its very heart, it's relationship. So God wants us to seek him and how do we seek Him? Well, we're going to find out through his word. And that's where you're going to find his will and that's when you're going to begin to pray his will. So in essence, it's to bring us in line with his will. So we may not be there, but I believe through prayer and through the study of God's word, God aligns us and changes us and gets us to where we want his will to be done. So a lot of that is to discover what, what he wants is to get us on his page, oftentimes is to do that. But really, if you stop and think about it, I think one of the reasons that we're told if God knows what he's going to do, why does he want us to pray is to grow our faith. It grows our faith. You remember you just said Moses had to be good for him that he saw, wow, God. So it grows our faith. I think it's also one of, look, I've got kids that are grown now. But you know what, I still like it every now and then when they call and say, dad, how do I do something? How do I do this? Dad, I need some help. I like that. I mean, in essence, I don't get it as much. So there are times I say, well, I must have done a good job and raised some self sufficient adults. But man, when they called dear old dad and want to know, not borrowing money, but want to know something, okay, that makes me feel good as a dad. But at its very core too is prayer is dependence. In fact, I like that. Well, thank you for your. [00:59:04] Speaker C: Yeah, I do. I hadn't thought about that. [00:59:07] Speaker B: Well, let me say this. [00:59:09] Speaker A: Start giving Kenny a red paddle and a green paddle. [00:59:11] Speaker B: He's holding up agree, disagree or thumb sideways. No. One of the things that I've said oftentimes is show me your prayer life and I'll show you how much you depend upon God. Because if you're not praying, you're not depending. You're depending on yourself. But if you're not praying, you're not depending. And so prayer is dependence. And that's why prayer is humility. But it takes humbleness to be dependent upon God. And so that's one of the key things. So prayer is dependent dependence upon him to see exactly what's going to happen. Do you remember when David and I'm sorry, Samuel and Saul were talking to one another and Samuel said, he basically said, God forbid that I would sin in not praying for you. I believe that part of this prayer is also, hey, I want to be praying, because I don't. I believe God has called us to pray. Therefore, why don't we pray? We should pray. And so part of it is, why do we even know God's going to do it? It's all about seeking him. It's about depending. It's about growing. Is that standing crowd that was. [01:00:25] Speaker C: Yeah, we saw a lot of things. Well, in some. But I guess what you're really. Prayer and God's will should be always working together. [01:00:38] Speaker B: Yes. And oftentimes, I mean, think about it. I know there are passages in the scripture. Paul. Paul wanted to go to Bithynia and prayed and prayed and prayed and was forbidden by the Spirit until he got his Macedonia call. And so Paul was seeking the Lord. Paul was seeking God's will. And it wasn't that Paul was out of God's will. He just wasn't finding it yet because he thought, man, I got to go talk to these people over here. And God had a different plan. He was to send Peter to Bithynia because that's who first Peter and second Peter has written to and sent Paul to Macedonia. And so it's all about seeking his will in his heart. He wasn't out of the will of God. He was just seeking God's will. [01:01:22] Speaker C: Well, here's the big question. If someone that doesn't have salvation or someone that's not following the Lord, and if they don't and you pray for them, and you pray for them, you know, you continually, continually pray for them, you see no evidence and then. And they might. Does that ensure. [01:01:55] Speaker A: Will? [01:01:55] Speaker C: That ensure that they will come to salvation at some point? How does that work with praying for someone's salvation? Well, that's a schedule. That's a tough one for me to kind of, I guess, to figure out. [01:02:14] Speaker B: Yeah, I think it's one of where I've always come to that because I've wrestled with that question many times, Kenny. I think one of the things that I got to a place of is if I know the Holy Spirit has laid that on my heart and I know the promises of God that he would have all men come to salvation. And I began to cry out for that person, I'm going to trust God to God. You didn't lay this person on my heart just for kicks and giggles. You didn't lay this person on my heart just so that it cannot come to fruition. And I think it's okay to. To begin to say, God, you promised. You laid him on my heart. And this is your so, Lord, would you send the Holy Spirit now and then? I think it's one of those that, just like you said in Corinthians, we pray that because the God of this age, small G God of this age has blinded them, that their eyes would be open, that they would hear the Holy Spirit. Because I believe when we're praying in accordance to that, I believe the Holy Spirit may be working in that person's life again, goes back to that person accepting it. But I'm going to keep praying and keep praying and keep praying. [01:03:25] Speaker C: See, here's one thing that I have I can't reconcile is my grandmother prayed for my uncle. I mean, every day, I'm not talking about just five minutes, I'm talking about hours. I just remember her weeping in the back of her room praying for her uncle. And I always remember that. And then when I'm having a hard time reconciling because I'll probably never be able to or fully understand it is I was talking to him about salvation and he said he didn't want anything to do with God. [01:04:09] Speaker B: How long? I mean, where was he at in his life? [01:04:12] Speaker C: Well, he'd never been in a good place. And then two weeks later, he died in his sleep of a massive heart attack. So I'm trying to reconcile the scriptures with what I actually saw. And maybe I didn't see it the final minutes. [01:04:33] Speaker B: Well, I think that's just, that's a tough one. And I think the thing of it is, though, I think it's one of, you know, calling God as far as, hey, and again, I don't want to say calling God out because I don't ever want to do that. At the same time claiming those promises and saying, God, you promised, you said in your word that if I follow you, if I give my whole heart to Satan seeking you, you'll direct my paths, that you're a good God, you're a faithful God. So, Lord, I mean, those are things that he don't mind you calling him on those. And again, I hate to say calling out, but he does not mind reminding him. [01:05:09] Speaker A: Well, it's not calling it out to say, lord, I know, I know that you. And then reciting those things to him. Right? It's not saying, hey, you told me this and you better. It's just reminding him of anything. [01:05:20] Speaker B: I think it builds your faith too. [01:05:21] Speaker A: That's it. [01:05:22] Speaker B: To remind yourself, to remind yourself. That's it. No, no, I know the promises and I'm going to trust those promises. [01:05:27] Speaker C: And I know he was in church, he hated to go to church. But I do remember him going to church, sitting on the Back row maybe didn't learn anything, but she did. My grandmother didn't get saved until she was in her 60s. Right. [01:05:40] Speaker B: And you don't know that he didn't make a decision. [01:05:42] Speaker C: No, I don't. I don't. I mean, all I know is up that two weeks before he passed, passed. [01:05:48] Speaker B: Away, God stuff that was. [01:05:50] Speaker C: And basically. And so. And I do know during church he would always sit on the back row and he, you know, there was never a commitment that I'm aware of that. [01:06:03] Speaker B: I should say there was never a. [01:06:04] Speaker C: Lot I never saw a commitment. And so I just. But I do know the Bible says Moses tells Israel that raise people, train your children in the ways of the Lord and when they get older, they will not depart. Now, does that mean that they will remember that, but they still have a choice or will they accept that? Do you see what I'm. [01:06:30] Speaker B: Yeah. And that's a promise that you have to be careful about because Proverbs 22:6 does not just mean that, okay, if I'm going to raise my child this one way, he'll never rebel, he'll never remember. He might even go off the rails and never come back. We claim that as that, but that verse actually means raise them up the way they are bent. In other words, the way that they are, the way their heart is and the way that they. What they learn and how they learn train them up in that way. And that's the thing of it. It's not just train them up into. It is helping them to grow as they are in the Lord. And so that's how it gets ingrained in their life. And so that's the promise there. So it's one of. I hate to always. I hear people claim that promise. Well, I'm not claiming. No, no. I'm just saying people misclaim that one a lot. [01:07:24] Speaker C: I mean, my thinking on that, if you. I don't think it's a salvation. No scripture. I think if you train somebody and teach them the Bible, they will not forget that they know how it'll be. [01:07:40] Speaker B: Hidden in their heart or it's on their heart. [01:07:43] Speaker C: And when the time comes, they have a lot better chance of accepting Christ as somebody that's never had. [01:07:50] Speaker B: Or they might have a chance to do what's right versus wrong and they know what's right and wrong a little bit bit better. [01:07:56] Speaker C: And that's how I'm looking at that verse. Not that it's a no, they're going to be saved, no, but that they have the background and they had The. They had been trained on how to. [01:08:07] Speaker B: But they can still reject it. [01:08:09] Speaker C: Yes, that's how. I mean, that's. I don't know if you can take it another way, but that's how I kind of. [01:08:14] Speaker B: No, I think that's what's implied. [01:08:16] Speaker A: One of the things that talk about taking the scenic route. I think God takes the saint scene of crowd an awful lot. And we can forget sometimes that we're playing checkers and he's playing 3D chess or whatever it is. Because one of the things that I've noticed in a lot of different ways is, number one, a lot of times when I'm praying for others, God's real quick to tell me something that I need to do to help. And it's like, well, no, I meant for you to do something. I didn't know you wanted me to do something. A lot of times he gives me something to do. So then I do that thing. Now, does that thing make a difference? I have no idea. But that thing shows me something or teaches me something I didn't know. And then that does something else for me down the road and takes me somewhere else. And next thing I know, I'm 27 degrees later that the prayer I originally prayed is finally answered. But look at all this extra fruit that came from him not answering it right away. And I think there's a lot of that that goes on and we just bang our head against the wall thinking, why is he not answering this? Why is he not. He's in the process of answering it. And his answers a lot of times are a lot longer because he. [01:09:17] Speaker B: He goes in from the beginning. [01:09:19] Speaker A: That's right. [01:09:19] Speaker B: And there's so many things that are involved that we don't even know and see. So many things that maybe in his perfect timing, that person, if we're praying for. That's kind of been the theme today. We pray for salvation for somebody. It may be that they get saved much later because it's going to impact somebody else. I mean, that. That's God's infinite wisdom. And that's where you trust him to say, I'm going to leave it in your hands, God. [01:09:45] Speaker A: There's so many things that I wish God would have just answered it right away the way I wanted it. But he takes forever to answer it. But in that time it wasn't fruitless. He gave me 12 blessings for the one that I was asking for, and I had to take a long time to get there. But it was well worth it in the end. And I sure am glad he didn't just answer it the first time I asked like I wanted it to. But sometimes we're, you know, we're asking him for a hotel room for the night and he's building us a house. That's why it takes a little while. You know what I mean? Exactly. [01:10:15] Speaker B: And I think too, there's a piece there that if you look, Jesus says, keep asking, keep seeking, keep knocking. It's not just, okay, one time, I didn't get it, I'm done. No, I think it's something that builds up our faith because if God answered it all immediately, then it would be. He would be seen as a genie in the sky versus no Lord. And oftentimes, remember, prayer is not so much about us changing God, it's about God changing us. And so a lot of times that asking that seeking, the weeping, the crying at night, God, why doesn't this seem to be changing? It may be that God's doing a work in us, like you said. It might be God wants you to go somewhere or be changed yourself. But prayer is about changing you, not changing God. He's the same. [01:11:09] Speaker C: This is what I found out, or seems to be. What happens is the more people that are involved in your prayer, and I'm talking about situation prayer, not people praying for it, but involved in the situation, the longer it takes and it might not happen. Here's one thing that I've seen. I've seen a lot of people pray for their marriage. One person is on the right track. [01:11:39] Speaker B: Okay, sure. [01:11:41] Speaker C: And they repented and they're trusting God and everything. Okay, I got you. But they got a divorce. The other one divorced them. Now, here's my thinking on that is a lot of times prayers or prayers when it involves more than one person, you have to have both wills to come in line. And one of them might not. You know, I just know so many women that have prayed for their marriage to be healed and they're following the Lord and everything else, then they get a divorce. So my question is, I think God's going to help you get through it. Definitely. And it was God's will for you to stay married. But there is also free will. [01:12:37] Speaker B: That's it. God's perfect. [01:12:39] Speaker C: So, you know, and you start questioning, well, their marriage worked out, but mine didn't. Why you start questioning God, and it's because the other person didn't want it to work out. And God's not going to change that. [01:12:55] Speaker A: Well, sometimes his answer is, my grace is sufficient. Yes, that's going to be part of it. Too, sometimes. [01:13:01] Speaker C: And that's hard to accept. [01:13:02] Speaker B: I think you're exactly right. I don't know that I have scripture to back it up. More people involved, the longer it takes. I don't know that I have any scripture, but I think you're right. But I think anytime you got two hearts, three hearts, a nation's heart, world. [01:13:19] Speaker C: Peace, we haven't had that because there's so many people. [01:13:22] Speaker B: But you think about a nation turning to God, and that's what Daniel's prayer is going to be in chapter nine is. Man, no wonder it doesn't happen overnight. Just like they didn't end up in exile overnight. It was a long process of God trying to call them back. Trying to call them back. They finally filled up the wrath, so to speak. [01:13:44] Speaker C: I mean, you're already there, but that person's not right. And that person might not get there, but if it does, then that's answered prayer. If it doesn't, you think, well, God didn't answer that prayer. And a lot of prayer has to do with. And that's the same thing with talking about salvation. You can train them and pray for them, but the ultimate decision is them for accepting Christ one way or the other, unfortunately. But they do have a whole lot better chance. [01:14:16] Speaker B: Agreed. [01:14:18] Speaker C: Well, thank you. [01:14:21] Speaker B: Approved. [01:14:21] Speaker A: Approved. Green. [01:14:22] Speaker B: First time you. Thumbs up, say these words. Yeah, yeah. No, I agree with you. Check your. Check your show, man. Go back and listen. Oh, yeah, you're right. I don't give you no. I just might have to add on sometimes. [01:14:35] Speaker A: All right, boys, I gotta run. See y'. All. [01:14:37] Speaker C: Okay. [01:14:41] Speaker B: What else we're doing. We're doing the deacon's list, and then we can do that and write that down. [01:14:46] Speaker A: That ain't that big a deal. [01:14:47] Speaker C: I don't. I. I think I can remember three things, but. [01:14:50] Speaker B: Yeah, by the time we get done with this show. Come on, man. [01:14:54] Speaker A: Come on, let's not. Let's not be silly. [01:14:57] Speaker C: And meeting. [01:15:01] Speaker B: And I think the other one. I can't. Golly. I wrote down one more thing here. Maybe. Maybe I can't read it. Oh, my goodness. [01:15:10] Speaker A: Evan can't read your own writing? I've been. [01:15:12] Speaker B: I know what it was. Try typing when.